Ep 68 Transcript: Speak with Power, Lead with Purpose, and Grow Your Business with Kimberly Spencer

This transcript was auto-generated and may contain errors in spelling or inaccuracies in the spoken words.

Hello and welcome to the Real Women Real Business podcast. am your host, Shauna Lynn Simon, and today I am being joined by an award winning, high performance, trauma informed coach and trainer. She's also an Amazon bestselling author, TEDx speaker, and she's joining us today. We're going to be talking about podcasting and how to guest on podcasts. And so I'm going to welcome Kimberly Spencer. Thank you so much for joining me. Thank you so much for having me, Shauna Lynn. I'm so excited.

listening to your episode all on visibility, on visioning before this, like as prep, which is like one of the number one things that I recommend. If you go on a show, just like listen while you're doing your makeup. But I was listening and I was like, oh, we are going to vibe because our coaching styles are like, I'm like visualization. So cool. We're both runners, like love your episodes. Yeah.

I didn't realize you're a runner as well. Yeah. And you know what? It's funny. The visualization episode, I just felt a calling to do it because so many people talk about the whole I'm just seeing so much on Instagram and so much about this whole manifestation. like, manifestation isn't just think about something and it comes to you. So I did the whole episode like you got to have some there's some science to this. This is a very real thing. You got to add some action to it as well. So I wanted to make it a little bit more.

than just the 30 second reel you see on Instagram that shows all the fancy jets and luxury hotels and everything else. So, okay, let's go back to though, because I wanna talk a little bit about you've got a ton of experience in communications and in speaking, and you are the CEO of a company called Communication Queens, where you actually help people with podcast guessing. Am I getting that correct? Yeah, so we started out as doing a done for you agency of the end to end booking and all that.

And it was going, it was after the release of my book, Make Every Podcast Want You. And I was on this huge high and also pregnant with my third child. And I didn't realize I had borderline anemia and my energy tanked after doing my book tour. And I looked at all the managerial responsibility going into the, of managing a full fledged agency. And I just was like, no. And then we asked our clients what they wanted more of. And they were like, they actually wanted more of my coaching and consulting.

around their communication, around their visibility strategy, rather than just the done for you services. And I said, well, why we just do that? That's easier. we completely pivoted in Q4 to now what we do is we go into business owners who have at least one VA and we train your team. We build the system out for you. And then I coach and consult on how you're showing up on podcasts and the energy that you're bringing to.

the communication, the stories that you're leveraging, what are the brand stories that you're telling? How could you tell them maybe a little bit more effectively? ⁓ And then leveraging all of my training from nine years coaching high performing leaders. And then we just funnel that into ⁓ this new model, which I love so much more. And I'm so much more in line with. So before we dive into all of that then, you just kind of alluded to a little bit of your experience. Let's talk a little bit about what brought you to where you are today. Tell us a...

a brief synopsis of who Kimberly is and how you got to this point. So storytelling has always been in my background. Like I started out when I was 17 years old, screenwriting in Hollywood, like interning at all the ⁓ agencies. That was my dream back then was to work in Hollywood. I fulfilled it at the age of 24, being the co-screenwriter of a movie called Bro' that is a high-flying freestyle motocross starring Danny Trejo, which most people look at me and they're like,

Wait, you wrote that? But it was a transformative story. And as I'm sitting there at the premiere, I realized, I learned that that story transformed three people's lives, like literally changed them from going down a path that was very dangerous, drug infused, et cetera, and that they changed their lifestyle because of this film, because of a story. And prior to that, in order to support myself in Hollywood, I had started teaching Pilates.

And because Pilates was one of the ways that I retrained my own mindset and physical body set from a 10 year battle with bulimia, where I healed with no psychological or medical intervention. within two years of teaching, I was the highest paid, most fully booked freelancing instructor at the studio that I was working at, ended up growing and building my own private Pilates studio in LA. That was my first business to support myself in Hollywood. And then from that opportunity after the film premiered, I was like, well,

I actually want to be more in charge of things. And a consulting opportunity presented itself for an e-commerce product that was a backstretching device. And I was like, cool, entrepreneurship combined with my background in fitness, let's marry them together. I saw the product. said, I can sell this. Like, I don't just want to be a consultant. I want to be president of this company. And my audacity at 24. And so that's exactly what happened. And so I was president of that company for two years.

grew it, got pitched into the first round of Shark Tanks, got it into all the major press, like featured in New York Times Square, all the things we started making sales. within two years, my business partner and I, we had a really different perception as far as how businesses should be run. We had very different values.

I come from an entrepreneur family. I'm second generation entrepreneur. So I am all about starting small and scrappy and really looking at every dollar being invested back into the marketing, not just into like renting an office. So run my office out of the basement of my house. There were different choices that were made. And from that, my business partner decided he wanted to buy me out. ⁓

Well, he just first decided he wanted me out. And then I said, well, you're going to have to buy me out. And so I had a successful exit. We signed the buyout agreement three weeks before I got married to my husband. I flew off to Italy on my six week honeymoon. And I was like, I don't know what I'm going to do when I get back. And so I'm there. And that was where the birth of my coaching company, Crown Yourself, came. It took me a year and a half to actually get my butt into gear because I was so like,

I didn't realize how much trauma I had experienced from dealing with lawyers for three months because when I didn't realize that they don't send you the nicest emails when they're not on your side. So, and in negotiations, was heated and there was a lot of contention on both sides. And so I didn't realize that I had taken that into my business. And it took me about a year and a half to, in essence, get my stuff together. And

From that, I then got certified in NLP, timeline therapy and hypnosis because I knew my financial block was not, was fully up here. It was fully in the mind. It was not of a capacity level. Cause I built a successful fitness studio and I like, but that, that doubt and that experience just weighed on my soul and made me question everything.

Fast forward, my coaching business is growing. I closed my fitness studio. I am fully invested by 2018 in coaching, 2020 hits. And I'm in Australia with my husband and our then toddler son. And we're there and it's March of 2020. And we all kind of know what happened in that year. We're hanging out with the cast of The Walking Dead as the global pandemic breaks out. My husband's a voice actor.

We go to literally hanging out with the cast literally hanging out with the cast of The Walking Dead. And so we're there. And my husband looks at me and we're like, you know, I'd really love to like our part of our dream was to live abroad. And I was like, well, why not now? Like, it's two weeks. We have three months on our visa. If this thing goes longer, like, let's try it. And he was like, well, my industry is probably going to shut down. And I said, my business is in a place where I can support us. We're good. So that's what we did. And we decided to stay and

you know, two weeks to flatten the curve turned into two years staying and living abroad. I ended up sending my husband to chef school, which was wonderful. And I then got pregnant with our second son and ate all his homework. during that time in Australia, my primary form of lead generation had been live events, doing workshops, interactive events, retreats and things like that. And

those I couldn't do not only because of COVID, but because of my visa. And so I said, well, how do I generate new business revenue? So we doubled down on our podcast. We've had the Crown Yourself podcast since 2019. We found that that was really good for client retention and for that longer term conversion game with people who weren't quite ready to invest yet in coaching, but they wanted to get to know, like entrust and build that relationship more with me. And then where

but I was like, okay, well, we still need new leads coming in. And that was when I remembered an interview that I had done in 2019 that had resulted in a $10,000 coaching contract. And it was a podcast interview and I was like, well, what if we tried that? And I was like, is that a thing? Like going on podcasts and doing that to generate business? Well, within 50 interviews, we generated over $70,000 of business revenue. We then have gone on to do over a quarter of a million in new business revenue, which is a lot harder than

recurring business revenue, as you know. absolutely. And then I said, well, does this work for other industries? So I created a course called Communication Queens. And then that turned into our agency. Because after the course, had clients who were like, I just want you to do this for me. Like instead of going through and learning how to build all the systems for that. Okay, great. So with my second child, I broke the second business. I always say I broke twins.

I'm not really into birthing a third at this moment, but who knows? see. Well, that is, I mean, that is quite the story. There are so many things that I would love to dig further into because I, but I feel like if I did that, this interview would be about three hours long. But I can tell you, I have a ton of respect for you coming from a Pilates background because it is one of those arts that I have.

reflected on for years. started in Pilates in my 20s, got away from it for some time. There's a lot of, as you know, quote unquote fake Pilates out there, but true Pilates is one of the greatest things that you can do for your body. And as a runner and as someone who has some aches and pains right now because I haven't been doing my Pilates, I'm very aware of the vast that it has. Vast difference as a runner. I've run

six marathons now, one of which I trained without Pilates. ⁓ my God, the difference is astounding. But that for me, Pilates was a way, like I didn't enter into personal development and coaching from the mental realm. I entered from the physical, because that was where I found the need for change. And that's where it's, when you bring that physicalization and energy to your speaking, to your communication, to what you do,

it changes how you show up. I mean, I've seen the difference ⁓ in results with clients who go on a podcast interview and they're not physically energetically engaged. And you can tell, cause their body isn't present in that moment. They're going through the routine. They're going through the motions.

And you can tell when someone has told the story, they've said it 15,000 times on multiple shows and on keynotes and stages and all the things. And if you're here, here goes their brand story. And those are never the ones that we see conversions from into referrals and greater business and relational development that can come from podcasting. OK, so I think this is a great point that you're bringing up here. I know for myself, whether I'm interviewing a guest like you or if I'm going as a guest onto another podcast,

One of the things that I have trained my mind to do is when I get my 15 minute reminder telling me I have my interview coming up, I stand up, period, full stop, get up from my desk. I never just shift from like, I was just replying to a bunch of emails and now I'm gonna go do a podcast interview. So I stand up, I walk around, maybe I get myself a cup of tea, maybe I do a couple of stretches. It's not even like I'm leaving my house necessarily.

But I do need to physically move myself, move my body. And then I might sit down and do start getting my computer set up and the prep, that kind of stuff. But ⁓ I do feel that physical connection. I know anyone who's a Tony Robbins fan, he talks about the state that you're in and that you show up in. I we've all had a bad day. I have had some really crappy things happen right before an interview. But you've got to put yourself into that state and one of like that

the mental state and the best way to do that is to get into the right physical state as well. So what are some tips that you can share? Because you've had a lot more experience, I'm sure, than I do on this. what are some tips that you can share in terms of getting into that physical state before an interview? Breathing. Now, first and foremost is like getting in touch with your breath. Breath is connected deeply to spirit. If you're into like esoteric wisdom.

Like it is, breath is a source of life. So definitely a lot of times, if you're in the middle of doing things, especially if you've been seated for a while, you aren't necessarily breathing. Most people breathe, and I know this is a Pilates instructor formerly, like most people breathe only in the top one third of their lungs. And where you get that resonant deep speaking voice is actually from your diaphragm, which is lower. And so making sure that just like Pilates, that you're breathing down into the rib cage, expanding the lower part of your rib cage,

allowing for that to open because that lower part of the rib cage and the top part of the rib cage, they are protecting your two most powerful, not the most powerful, but two very powerful chakras, which are your solar plexus and your heart chakra with center of power and then your open heart. And people can feel that heart resonance when you're showing up versus when you're just going through the motions and it's just another interview and it's just another connection.

I like to think mentally, like this is a first date for me and Shauna Lynn. Like it's a business date. We are learning about each other. Like I just got to learn about all her amazing cats. And one of them, I'm like, he stays on the desk the entire time. And then he keeps like putting his butt up in the air. I'm like, yeah, there's, there you go. That's Logan. Yeah.

I love it. And like she learned about me and you know, we may have a tough three year old interrupting us briefly, but it builds that initial relationship of like, where could this go? I don't know. It could go into referrals. We could go into some collaborations. It could just go into us mutually supporting each other on social media. And who doesn't love a little bit more of that? Absolutely. But it comes from being energetically present for the relationships.

And where I see people get make the mistake is they treat the visibility opportunity of a podcast interview like a one night stand where it's like, hey, thank you for showing up ⁓ and thanks for the visibility and bye. Yeah. Yeah. So, so incredibly true. And I mean, and I will say it definitely goes both ways because I have guested on podcasts where I feel like I've been ghosted afterwards and some days like,

I had one podcast I interviewed on last year and I followed up immediately, of course, with my thank you and looking forward to when the episode comes out. Please let me know when you expect it to be available. And then my admin was following up for months asking when is this going to be released? And I think it was something like nine months later that we get this email, your podcast is live. I didn't share it. We had never received a single response to any of our communication.

to prepare for it, to ask about it. So, well, I'm not, no, if you're going to treat me like that, I have zero desire to share this, this episode. And I will also say I didn't connect well with, with the host. And sometimes that happens as well. Yeah. You know, and that's honestly the first time that's ever actually happened to me to that extreme where I'm like, I'm not sharing this episode. It's fine that it exists out there, but I'm not going to share it. But I'm very big on, like you said, building that.

relationship and it comes it's two-sided from both the podcast host and the guest and ensuring that we're connected and building that rapport from the very start. And I mean, as someone who's had a lot of podcast experience, know, you don't always connect as well with some people, but you can always find that common ground and find a way that you're supporting each other's messages because it's not just about me. It's not just about you. This is about how this plays out, not for us, but for the people.

that are going to be listening to this episode and how can we best support them at the end of the day? And that's the other piece to recognize is that as a podcaster, and I've had mine for now five years, I never normally math in public. ⁓ Yeah. Mistake. But very smart. Having a podcast, like the relationship with the pod that the podcaster has with their audience has to be revered.

because they care more about that audience that they have spent so much more time developing that relationship than they have with you. And yes, they're bringing you to their audience, which is one of their most valuable assets because their audience is their list, it's their followership, it's where they source their income from typically if the podcast is associated with the business. So being respectful of that audience and looking at how can I deliver the most amount of value for this audience.

How can I show up? What is a unique perspective that I can give? Because the hard part on the guesting side is sometimes for the guests, their audience has already heard their message multiple times. So you as a guest have to think, well, what will make this episode unique to my audience so I can drop something that's unique and special that they will wanna listen so it adds value to Shauna Lynn?

and or whatever podcasts are going on. And then vice versa, what is something unique and different that could be a value to the podcasters audience that would be different so that my episode can stand out so that it can support that community. So it's really being intentional and not just looking at, I just need to get on podcasts or, I just need to get on Netflix or, I just need to get on this. Like I've been on Netflix, I've been in Forbes. And can I like...

I had more people coming to me from guest podcasting as conversions than from high, high level PR that I've received. Right. And, and you know what? want to dig into that a little bit further because yes, she was on Netflix and people are probably wondering, want to know a little bit more about that. And we're going to come back to that after this very quick message.

All right, welcome back to the Real Women Real Business podcast where Kimberly was telling us that she's actually been on Netflix, but it didn't give her the same sort of exposure and visibility and success if we're going to label it that way. And I don't want to say success. It's maybe not quite the right word, but the conversions that you might expect. know a lot of people that say, I just need to get my own show or I just need to be interviewed on TV and then my business will take off. And it's a big misconception that the show is going to get you the audience that you need. So.

Kimberly, tell us a little bit more about first of all, what was your experience on Netflix? And then how is that different from your guesting experience on podcasts? So the film that I co-wrote was ⁓ on Netflix. And then my husband and I had an opportunity to be on a docu-series around fatherhood that also featured my business, that also featured my husband, that featured our story and ⁓ the birth of our first son.

And of course, in typical Leo fashion, like he gets born on a Netflix show, come on. Sure, why not? Why not? Yes. on. He's born a star. Born a star. So of course, like they feature my business, show photos, they show what I do, they highlight me, but it's a leverage point. And so you wanna think of any form of PR as a leverage point.

What I did, it wasn't that the Netflix show, which was associated with Chicken Soup for the Soul, brought me hundreds of thousands of leads and conversions. In fact, when I published my book ⁓ and I was posting in a few author groups around looking for someone to help me with Amazon ads, someone was like, this is spam. How can someone with this resume be in a Facebook group asking for business?

I'm seriously looking for someone to help me with our Amazon ads. Like, But it was just, it's so interesting people's perceptions of what comes with a label. So yes, been on Netflix, yes, been in Forbes, yes, been in CBS, ⁓ but at the same time, yes, been on national, no, not national, statewide news. ⁓ But each time it was a leverage opportunity in how you turned out.

one press opportunity. I mean, you may get 15 minutes of fame on a show like the Today Show or some local news channel. And yet that's only 15 seconds that probably not your ideal customer is listening to, but it is a leverage piece that you can then use as part of your introduction, as part of social media, showing, not just telling. So like when my book was featured,

in New York Times Square as one of the top books of 2024 to change your life and business. That I was like, this is a leverage opportunity. We are going to take the pictures. It's not just going to be, because it was only on the billboard for 24 hours. The amount of people in Times Square that are possibly my ideal customer on that day is so random that odds are that's probably not the leverage point I want to just use.

It's also not what they're looking for as they're walking through Times Square like, I that book and I'm going on to Audible right now or Amazon to download and order it or whatever. Yeah, it is a press opportunity that provides you with.

with leverage beyond the scope of that opportunity. Because like you said, like they're probably wandering through on vacation. They're looking not to get like manhandled by Spider-Man. Like. They've got higher priorities than to download your book. Yeah. They're possibly looking not to be robbed. Like. Yeah. All the priorities. There's a multitude of things going on and it's probably not like, let me just look at this amazing gorgeous billboard. ⁓

that moment, capturing that moment and then seizing that and then showcasing that and then letting that be something that you continuously talk about, that is a point of leverage. So you wanna look at how are you leveraging the podcast opportunity? And one of the great things about a podcast interview is you don't have to work so hard. Like on a webinar, when you do your own webinars, you're like, here, let me prove to you all of my accolades. Let me prove to you all of this thing.

When you go on a podcast, you have the podcaster just by proximity. Like you said, Tony Robbins has said proximity is power. proximity, just by proximity, I'm positioned as an expert. Shauna Lynn's position as an expert. Your position as an expert just because they are positioning you as the expert coming onto the show. Right. And this is something I talk about with my clients all the time.

because they seem to have this idea sometimes like if I can just get on some podcasts, then my business will blow up. And they're not necessarily wrong. Yes, this is a powerful strategy for any business, but it's not you have to do the work. You can't be expecting that the podcast is going to do the work for you. Yes, your podcast should promote you. Your podcast should probably get in touch with you less than nine months into after the podcast was.

was recorded to tell you what the next steps are. Your podcast should provide you with some sort of graphics. You may create your own graphics. I personally have a template that I use for every podcast that I guest on that I put into my stories that I put into my posts. And we have a system and a process behind the scenes for ensuring that every podcast I am on gets the visibility that it deserves. And I will be frank with everyone who's listening to this as well as a podcast host.

I can tell you and not only as a podcast host, but as someone who has guested on a lot of podcasts, there is a conversation behind the scenes that says, if I put you on my podcast, what are you going to do to promote the episode? You are responsible for promoting it. Yes, I'm going to promote it. I'm going to promote it to my audience. My audience continues to grow on a daily basis. I've been very, very fortunate and blessed with that. But the whole idea is that we're sharing our audience.

And we're helping to to leverage that. And you want to ensure that you are helping to promote that podcast not only for the value of that host that had you, but for your own value, because now look at the extra credibility that you've just given to yourself immediately by saying I was on this podcast, I was on this TV interview, I was in the newspaper, whatever it is. As you were saying, Kimberly, like get the photos at Times Square. It's what like you need. It's worth getting those photos.

Get the photos, get the reels, get all the things, get the video of you hitting. mean, when my book hit bestseller, we had a virtual launch book party and my intuition was just like, I know that if we make this book launch party three hours, we're gonna hit bestseller. So I had to figure out like how to make it valuable that people would stay on for three hours. And so we did a podcast, we did like podcast swaps, we did podcaster podcast guest meet and greets, but I got.

you know, the moment my publishing consultant reached out was like, you're number one. I to have that moment on camera, on film. And that is a valuable moment to then share with your audience. Because you are, by going on podcasts, you get to be that testimony and embodiment of your business, of your brand, of everything that you say that you stand for, which also means, because I'm not about fear-based marketing,

⁓ I'm about aspirational marketing, but not to the point of like, let me just ship, like, cause I think a lot of aspirational marketing, as I'm sure you've seen, Shauna Lynn is just like, let me see your revenue numbers and that's it. And I'm like, no, no, there's so much more to aspirational marketing when you lean into the goals and dreams of who your ideal customer is. And if your ideal customer has dreams of greater visibility or sharing their story or just being seen in their full authentic expression. And that's you going forward and doing that.

Woo, you get to be that demonstration and embodiment more so than just like, here's how you do it. Here's your how to. But it's so true, though, because, you you have to identify what is it that your your ideal client, your ideal customer wants and needs. But if you stop there, you miss out on the why does that matter? What is it that what is the bigger picture they're trying to achieve? It's like if your kid comes to you and asks you some random question like, do we have

popcorn, for example, you're like, ⁓ I think so. And then they ask you, do we have scissors? Maybe. Do we have tissue paper? You're like, OK, where are we going with this? If they led with like, this is what I'm trying to build here. If you say you don't have a particular item they're looking for, you can help them to troubleshoot something as an alternative as opposed to them scrapping the whole thing. So by understanding where it is that someone's actually trying to go, what is their end game? What is that end goal? And not that I think any entrepreneur ever has an actual

End game, so to speak, because once an entrepreneur, always an entrepreneur forever. But nonetheless, you need to have some sort of ⁓ your North Star, your GPS, your compass of like, what is it that we're trying to achieve? Is it flexibility in the number of hours we're working? Is it a financial freedom? You know, there's there's a lot of alignment often what people are aspiring to what they're looking for. So look at what you're selling and how is that helping them get there? And then, as you said, if you can live it and show it.

That's what people are going to connect with. That's what they're going to relate to. I don't relate to the person on Instagram who's jet setting all over the world with their husband and going to all these exotic places. Like, sure, I would love to travel more. That's not my idea of traveling, to be honest. So it doesn't mean that it's not aspirational to somebody else, but it's not going to connect with me. I'm going to connect with the people who tell a real story. And we all have a good extra riches story, of course, as well.

You know, a good grit story or something along those lines. But I'm going to relate to someone who connects with me. So, for example, my audience are women entrepreneurs who are feeling the growth of their business, but not knowing how to keep up with it in a sustainable way. And they feel like the only way to keep it going is to add more hours to their day. And they're slowly killing themselves and burning themselves out doing it.

And I come to them and say, don't worry, I got you. I've got the solution for you. I'm going to help you with this business. And of course, there's a lot more to just a five second spiel that I can give them. But essentially, I help them to fill in the foundational gaps to their business that they didn't get because no one gave you the guidebook to being a CEO when you started your business. And so I help behind the scenes to fill those things in in an already established business. So knowing, though, what it is that they're looking for, are they looking for those immediate quick fixes, those quick wins? Yes. But why?

because they're missing out on their family growing up. They're missing out on traveling. They're missing out on the flexibility that they started their company for. And a lot of times they're missing out on their passion that got them into the business in the first place because it's been buried under massive to-do lists. So going back to what you were saying about the aspirational marketing is you need to understand what it is that your audience truly wants. Why does it matter to them so that you can show them

that you understand exactly what they need and you can give it to them. yeah, and podcasts are a great opportunity to do that. What better way than to tell your own story? Yeah. Yeah. And then also to leverage the stories of your clients, your success. Every success story is a metaphor. Like in NLP, it was funny when I was ⁓ getting my book edited, my editor was like,

This is not actually a metaphor. You realize this, right? And I was like, yes, however, in NLP, which is what my first coaching certification was in, was in, and the- Just to stop for one moment, in case anyone is not familiar with NLP, this is Neurolinguistic Programming. I want to talk more about this. So I just wanted to stop you real quick just to make sure, because-

When I say NLP, some people, their eyes light up and they know exactly what you're talking about, but I get a lot of deer in headlight looks. So if you didn't know what that was, don't worry. You are among many, ⁓ probably the majority of people. So continue on. So, yeah. And if you're familiar with Tony Robbins, Tony Robbins is highly trained and skilled in neuro-linguistic programming. ⁓ So in neuro-linguistic programming, it's basically how language affects how our mindset is shaping reality.

and our programming around that. And so one of the tools of language is storytelling. And when you can tell a solid story, you can shift people's perspective because you bypass cognitive dissonance. So I could lay out all the facts and figures of, ⁓ you know, you know, 42 % of millennial podcast listeners report buying and purchasing based on podcast host recommendations.

66 % of podcast listeners are making over $75,000 a year, which totally trumps every other social media platform. buddy. I'm back. Hi, see you're back. I am on a podcast interview. Can I come with you in just a little bit and I'm a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. That's awesome. I will join you for that peanut butter and jelly sandwich in about 10 minutes. Okay. I did a one and two. Oh, that's great. Well, if you have a second one, I will join you for that. Okay? All right. I'll see you in a bit.

Cool. Thanks, love. We got all the cats and the kids in this episode. This is fantastic. Cats and kids. This is what women in business do, ladies. And that's balancing real life. And most of my clients are parents. Like, they understand. They're like, oh, your kid wanders in and just you have a little conversation and they'll wander out. They just want to just be recognized and noticed. Same with cats.

Exactly. Amazing. Okay. So neuro-linguistic programming. So neuro-linguistic programming and storytelling. Yes. It bypasses the cognitive dissonance. So I could list all the facts and figures as to why podcasting really works. But if I started out with facts and figures, you'd be like falling asleep at the wheel. And I don't want to bore you because I know a lot of people listen to podcasts while driving. And that would be not safe. That would be very dangerous. Yes.

But I started with the story of how I got into podcasting, how I got into podcast casting and what the results were from that. And then I led with that story in order to then share our client success stories as well. Our clients have gotten referrals and they've business right after the podcast because they've gotten summit ⁓ invitations. They've gotten keynote speaking opportunities all from the developing relationship that they had with the podcaster because of a podcast interview that went well.

that was a lie. And that the perk is, that when you can tell stories effectively and every one of your client result stories is a metaphor for the transformation that you provide through your products and services. Right. And I have to admit, you know, it's so funny. One of the things I love about hosting this podcast is the gentle reminders that I get is, know, even as coaches,

We need a little kick in the butt sometimes on some of the things. It's one of those, know, kind of like a parent say as I do as I say, not as I do kind of thing. And there are definitely times where I'm like, oh, I am not doing as well as I say I should be doing. And it's funny, you know, I know exactly what you're saying. I know I should be sharing more client stories on my podcast. And I'm very careful to I always change the name of my clients to protect their identity. Like, yes, there are testimonials with people's actual real names, but I find that those are always surface level.

and the real stories, I try to protect a lot of their confidentiality because people don't want to know, especially like my clients are coming to me with their businesses, quote unquote, their words, a total mess. And I take that mess and that chaos and help them to organize it. But they never want anyone to know. It's just like you never want anyone to know just how messy that closet was before you organized it. But you're proud to show it off when it's done. Right. ⁓ yeah. Like and I totally get it because I walked into I'm part of a group called the Dames for six, seven and eight figure business women.

And I walked into their conference ⁓ from the practice of scaling our agency and going through the book launching process, but it put us in a cashflow crunch ⁓ with our OPEX and operational expenses and team. And so the pivot into the consulting was like heaven for me. But I walked into this room of business owners and it was a very small room because the other panel that was happening was marketing and publicity. And that was packed.

This was a very small room. Nobody wanted to look at their financial. I'm aware. Yes. Right. And being able to sit in that room and be like, my God, I'm not alone in this experience. Cause I think once you get past a certain confidence level and that you know, you're able to generate revenue, it's that next level of cashflow and profit and the sustainable systems and time freedom that really become more valuable than revenue.

And this is such an important topic and I don't want to go too far into it on this episode just because it's taking us a little bit off course. But I just want to say with gratitude, thank you for sharing that because I think that it's something that there's a lot of shame attached to facing challenges in terms of cash flow and profitability. And I can tell you that every single business has been there and done that. And even when someone comes to me with kind of a flex of like, I've never had to borrow any money for my business. It's actually not my favorite flex because I feel as though

Sometimes in order to do the big things and to navigate cash flow sometimes a temporary loan is actually necessary Provided that you have a plan to pay it back. Of course, I'm a big profit first believer. So yeah, yeah same here I'm a big practice or that so, you know debt is not necessarily a bad thing And again, I'm not trying to move the conversation into a whole financial conversation just to say just a very brief validation to anyone who's listening to this and feels like they might be

ashamed of some of the challenges that they've been facing in their own financials and their own cash flow. Know that that is a part of growth and it can be very stressful and very challenging, but know that we've all been through it. So thank you so much, Kimberly, for sharing that. feel like the audience really needed to hear that someone at your caliber, at your level can say, been there, done that, like at six figures, done that. Yeah, yeah. And that's that's one of the things that I've been more.

forward-facing in my messaging in general is just bringing that and stripping the shame away. Cause I know how much shame I had about it when I was like, my gosh, I was, didn't take out a loan, but I, I invested my personal savings and funds. And when I realized, my gosh, I am taking away from my children. That was, that was a wake up call where I was like, no, my guy, have to have a realignment of values or strategy or systems or something. And I, I'm

I think with more women, the more we can open that up, open that conversation up and be honest about where we actually are and not just share revenue numbers, because revenue is vanity, profit is sanity, ⁓ then that changes the game for us because most men, when they go into business, they have this like period of time called ⁓ funding. We as women don't actually think that. We are the do it yourselves duck tape it together. We will bootstrap it.

We can. And we can. also, mean, statistics do show that women get a very, very small percentage of capital raising. it's a whole different mentality for us that we don't feel like there is much of a choice but to do it ourselves. But there is a whole different mentality around money and talking about money. I can remember I did just a ⁓ get to know you type of call with a

relatively local business person we've met on LinkedIn is that let's have a chat. I'd to learn more about your business. And, you know, we get to talking and she's telling me what this great business idea that she has. in my in the back of my mind, I'm saying I can't figure out where the profit is coming from, like where how is she making money? So I asked her, what is your profitability plan? She was so offended that I'd even ask this question. She said, you wouldn't ask that of a man. like, I'm terribly sorry. I profusely apologize, but I'm like.

I would absolutely ask this of a man. And in fact, men, this is just a commonplace conversation for them. But somehow she was offended thinking that I was judging her as a woman that she didn't know how to be profitable or didn't know how to make money. And the challenge is, and I'm not entirely blaming her for this. The point of this, of me sharing this is that women have been challenged and questioned quite a bit in our lives about our abilities.

and our knowledge of money and profitability. And so it's understandable that we almost feel like we have something to prove. And unfortunately, that ends up getting us into some sticky situations sometimes where we're not utilizing the money the way that we should. We're ⁓ spending it the way that we should. We're not preserving it the way that we should because we haven't even learned how to talk about it in the first place.

And so, and that is the first step to being able to get out of a difficult situation is being able to talk about it. And I'll admit, think guilty of it as well. so, yeah. I mean, I think that that is the, ⁓ the power of podcasts like yours, Shauna Lynn and being able to open up the conversation and have conversations that are not only just strategy and how to get to that next level, but also the realness of the conversations because

I'm blessed to have grown up with a second generation entrepreneur. And I watched my parents grow a multimillion dollar tree service business with my dad being a highly functioning alcoholic the whole time. ⁓ And that experience when I looked at it, well, what could they do in 10? The conversations, what could I do in 10? They did in 30. But the conversations are different when growing up and being in an environment where there is a lot more tolerance of risk.

And there is, and so that's why podcasts I think are so valuable when you can truly open up and be authentic about your truth and your experiences and do it in a way that still allows you to stay in that position of authority. And I think that that's a very delicate dance that some women fear as far as like, where is my truth? Where is other people's truth? Where does my authority get?

like shrouded by my story, like does this decrease my authority in this area as a high-performance business coach if I struggled with the cashflow challenge? ⁓ There's all those questions and there's looking at, well, actually these challenges actually set me up for being a much stronger coach. These challenges actually set me up for and positioned me so that I know like,

I know that when I went through my buyout experience, my gosh, I've walked multiple clients now through their buyouts or ⁓ through ⁓ letting go of an employee or things like that. And those experiences sucked and they hurt because you feel your ego gets hit where, my gosh, I made the quote unquote wrong decision. And we as a society, especially as women, we're so scared of making that wrong choice.

of like, because in business there's your, you have a smorgasbord of choices that could work for you. Right. That is fantastic. And while she's dealing with that, the point that I was going to add to that is that as a podcast host, can't speak of course for every podcast host out there, but I can tell you that as a podcast host, you know what I don't want to hear when I'm interviewing someone when I ask, you know, was that difficult to do? No, it super easy.

I don't want to hear that. I actually want to hear that it was challenging, that it was difficult. How did you overcome that? How did you make it through that? What were some of the mistakes that you made? You know, it's similar when you're raising children, for example, you would love to keep your children from making any mistakes that you made. It's not possible to do that, but the more that you can share with them, the more open you can be with them as opposed to hiding all the things that you did wrong.

giving them the opportunity to be able to fail comfortably, fail forward as we say, makes it that much easier for them to be able to navigate those difficult moments because if our expectation is that everything we touch is going to turn to gold, we're not well equipped to be able to deal with when things don't go wrong. And as an entrepreneur, things are going to go wrong, like a lot. And so if I can save you from making some of my mistakes,

Doesn't mean you're not going to make other mistakes, but those mistakes that you're making now gives you that valuable lesson that you can now take on to your own podcast and your own podcast interviews. As a podcast host, I don't want to hear like, yes, I want to hear your successes. Hundred percent. I want to hear your successes, but I want to hear like the funniest stories or when you fell flat on your face like, listen, I thought this was going to work and I launched it and nobody came and it was horrible. And like.

Be open about it. Be lively about it. Be raw. Be real. Be vulnerable. what? Be who you are. The more of that that you can give, the more you're going to connect with people. can't tell you how many people reach out to me on this podcast. And I'm sure, Kimberly, you get the same thing where, you know, they they'll tell me a particular episode just really hit home with them. I can't do that. I can't hit into the hearts of the people that are listening if I'm being disingenuous, if I'm not.

being talking about things that I truly believe in, things that I truly understand. And sometimes that means sharing some things that make me even a little uncomfortable. But I tell you, it's pretty therapeutic though when you share, when you air everything to an audience like this. It is liberating. also from like, because of my background in movie writing, like when you watch a Netflix show, for example, like, and you watch the final episode where like everything works out.

You are lost and like not engaged and you're not involved. You're not emotionally invested in the story. But when you start at episode one and you allow for that journey to evolve and you allow for your audience to go with you and go through the peaks and valleys and dark nights of the soul and every in those moments of like the all is lost moment. ⁓ All of those pieces are valuable for the emotional engagement of your audience and building that know, like and trust factor.

And when you can build that know, and trust factor, that's when people buy from you because people buy buying is an emotional experience. And when they know that either you've walked a walk or you've walked a similar walk or you've been vulnerable in a way that they would like to maybe be more honest and truthful with themselves. It's a game changer for how you show up and for the freedom that you have. Like you said, Sean, I'll end like with with just being able to feel.

Like there's nothing to hide in your business where yes, of course there will be things that legally you may need to keep private. And there will be moments of things that you will be in the moment dealing with. And I always say, it is unprocessed, unhealed trauma, that is not the space for a podcast. That is the space for a therapy or coaching session to like work it through and focus forward. But once you're on the other side of that experience and you glean the richness of the lessons,

That's when showcasing and walking people through that experience and telling the story of that can lead to powerful lessons that shorten the timeline for other people to experience growth and progress. So well said. There is a very big difference between airing your dirty laundry on an episode like this versus sharing a transformational and inspiring story. So know the difference when you're going to tell a story. You need to know the difference.

And going back to the storytelling that you were talking about, one of the things that I find happen sometimes when I'm listening to ⁓ some interviews occasionally, or even I've experienced it when I'm interviewing someone, the story doesn't go anywhere. There isn't anywhere for it to land. So it's just kind of a pretty story that isn't even that funny. It's not that interesting. Nothing really happened. Try to avoid those stories. So what would be your recommendation for someone if they are preparing for maybe their first or maybe they've done

podcast interviews before, maybe it's not their first interview, but they want to really up their game on their interviews. What are some things that they should be doing to prepare to have these stories and the conversations that they should have on these podcasts? Build your story backlog. Like one of the exercises I work through with our clients is we look at what are those success stories of your clients that you can share?

What are those metaphors that you can build of all of the stories so that you can just pull those out of thin air? Especially because sometimes I had to, I'll tell you this in a story. I had a client who was a very successful CFO and she was going through tax season and dealing with the CPA and the bookkeeper. And she's like, I don't like any of our clients right now.

stressful season. Okay, well, let's go through and we built her backlog of stories. And the beautiful thing was that through that experience, she transformed by the end of the coaching session. ⁓ I really do love our clients and the transformation that we provided. It's just we're in a stressful season. So it allowed her to see things differently, but it also gave her

a series of stories of all the ways that her work as a fractional CFO had been able to benefit, serve, and support others in transforming and growing their businesses. And I think that that's, so build your story backlog and then look at all of your own stories, small and large, like, build your longevity, that demonstrate that you have longevity in your industry or at least in your skillset that demonstrate that, ⁓

allow for you to have maybe a parallel realization. Like we had one client who was a divorce attorney and a divorce coach. She'd never had gone through a divorce herself. had a very happy, beautiful marriage, but she had gone through a business divorce. So the more she started talking about her business divorce, the more people were like, ⁓ she knows what I'm feeling about what it means to have a split of an asset and all the things that go into that. It built the know, like and trust factor. So what are the stories that

are parallel or could mirror an experience that your client may be experiencing that maybe you haven't personally experienced. And then look at what is the emotional arc that you're taking people through. And that's really what I dive into in my book, Make Every Podcast Want You on all the different, not only the types of stories that you have, the emotional beats that you can hit and land on when you're sharing your stories, how to beautifully flow from like,

concept and idea into the details of story and to back into concept and learning so that that way you have this beautiful ebb and flow versus here's all the conceptual things, but people don't really grab anything. They don't have anything tactile or actionable to learn from.

People want both. And when you have the communication versatility to be able to speak at a very high level and also give examples, like I'm a type of learner where I learned by example, where I'm like, I now see a possibility that I didn't see before. That allows, it opens up the amount of connection that you can have through stories.

And it's so true. mean, I'm great at telling stories of things that actually happened to myself or to my clients, things that I experienced firsthand. But if you ask me to regurgitate a story that someone else told, I won't be able to tell you the full story, but I can tell you the lesson I got out of it. And that's what a story is supposed to do. And so I love that you talked about the emotional arc that it needs to take. And again, the backlog of stories. One of my coaches once upon a time told me, actually it wasn't that long ago, maybe like a year ago, talked about making a timeline of your life, like drawing a straight line, essentially.

And then anything that was positive that happened in your lifetime goes above the line. Anything that was maybe more challenging, difficult, sad goes below the line. So this could be the loss of a loved one. It could be a bullying experience in elementary school. It can be a trauma that you experienced, but there's positive things that could be getting married. It could be winning a gold medal, know, whatever that looks like for you. And sometimes those experiences when you start going through kind of

If actually allow yourself to go through the various decades of your life and write things down, sometimes something pops out that you'd almost buried at one point. You're like, ⁓ and that's a really powerful story. So now can you align that with how it has shaped something in your business or how you operate today or, you know, related some way because it's so relatable talking about a story from when you were 15 years old and this awkward teenage girl or whatever like that can be very relatable.

provided that it, again, it has to go somewhere. It has to have some sort of ending to it. But I love what you're saying though about making sure that you're having that emotional arc and taking them through that journey ⁓ and really having that backlog of stories. It's really powerful. And the book that you're mentioning, so the book is how, Make Every Podcast Want You, how to be so radically interesting you'll barely keep yourself.

you'll barely keep from interviewing yourself. Did get that right? Yes. Yes. And don't worry if you don't remember the whole name. Just remember the Make Every Podcast Want You. We'll be sure to put a copy of that or a link for that in our show notes as well. So Kimberly, with everything we talked about today, we went on a whole journey today. We took everyone through quite the journey, through so many different areas. I would have loved to dive into some of these areas even further than we did. But of course,

We only have so much time and I know that our podcast listeners, especially if they're listening to us when they're driving, they're probably at their destination. I've tried to turn us back on three times now. So if we can leave everyone with one final thought, if there's one big takeaway that they take from today's discussion, what would you like them to leave with them?

lead with story, end with strategy. That's powerful. Well, that's a sound bite if I've ever heard one. And Shauna, Lynn, I would love to offer just for your audience an opportunity to come on to the Communication Queen podcast, where if they are challenged with how do I tell my story? How am I showing up on podcasts? And they would like an opportunity to test it.

and get some coaching and feedback in real time on the podcast about how they're sharing their story, what really lands, how they can do it better, what strategies they can offer and what they're doing well. ⁓ I would love to offer that for just your listeners that, and I'll give you the link after this so that they can come on and the communication between podcasts and apply. That is such an amazing opportunity. So listen, if you're listening to this and you're thinking, I want to get some more visibility, I want to...

I want to be a podcast guest and I want to be a quality podcast guest. This is a great opportunity right here to get yourself onto a podcast and be able to test out some of those stories. So make sure that you before you do that, you need to listen to this episode, take some notes, do the work and then get in touch with Kimberly for getting booked on that podcast. That's amazing. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that offer.

You are so, welcome. This has been such an honor to interview you, to have this discussion. I feel like we're old time friends. This is exactly what a podcast interview is supposed to feel like. So thank you so much for showing our listeners firsthand, which is what a pro you are and how to bring true value to every episode that you do. Thank you. Thank you so much, Shauna Lynn for having me. It has been such an honor and I have loved meeting your cast.

We're very visible today. So of course, if you're listening to this, all the resources that we mentioned on today's show will be available in the show notes for you. And what we're saying here today resonates with you. hope that you will allow us to continue to join you on your journey. Tune in each week to the Real Women Real Business podcast. Don't forget to leave us a review on your favorite podcast platform. Hit subscribe. And of course, the best way that you can show your support, not only to myself and to Kimberly, but to your fellow

women entrepreneurs is to share this episode with someone that you know really needs to hear it right now. And until next time, keep thriving.